>> charlie: welcomome to our program, we begin this evening with the president's news conference earlier today in washington, with chuck todd of nbc news and hans nichols of bloomberg television. >> i think in the president' press conference we heard sort of a resignationf sorts that look-- he knows how this is going to end. he is going to get a small deal of some sort. and heants to just define the terms of the post debate after the debt sealing is raised and after he signed some sort of bill tt might cut a little bit of spending but isn't going to include any tax hikes of any sort. might include a commission to look at entitlements or a congressional commission to look at tax reform. but ultimately it felt le almost a post debate. charlie: we look now to global implication of the conversations in washington and also in europe, the issue about sovereign debt.

joining us for that, john chambers of stdard & poor's, zanny menton of the economist magazine, gillian of "the financial times" and bill gross of pimco. >> the problems as john says may have actually helped the u.s. in the short term but we have the potential of a really perfect storm here. for some kind of accident on the debt ceing coupled with a dramatic worsening of the euro- land crisis in the next couple of weeks which could really shore up financial markets when you have both happeng at the same time. >> charlie: filly with late developments in washington we talk to andrew edgecliff johon about you rupert murdoch and the news corporation case in london. >> i tell you today is not the end of the story but with the resignation of rebecca brooks on tuesday, this is a story which will run for months if not years with police investigations, judicial inquiries, lawsuits and any number of other threats still piling up against the company, but it's a significant day. >> charlie: the president's press conference, global

implications for europe and the united states and the rupert murdoch case. funding for charlie rose was provided by the following: every story needs a hero we can all root for. who beats the odds and comes out on top. additional funding provided by these funders: but this isn't just a hollywood storyline. it's happening every da all across america. every time a storefront opens. or the midnight oil is burned. or when someone chases a dream, not just a dollar. they are small business owners. so if you wanna root for a real hero, support small business. shop small. additional funding pvided by these funders:

captioning sponsored b rose communications from our studios in new york citythiss charlie rose. >> charlie: president obama had a press conference earlier this morning following five days of closed door meetings with top congressional leaders. at the news conference his third in three weeks the president continued to press for a big deal to raise the debt ceiling and to reduce the deficit by $4 trillion. >> i am still pushing for us to achieve a big deal. but what i also said to the group is if we can't do the biggest deal possible, then let's still be ambitious. let's still try to at least get a down payment on deficit reduction. we are obviously running out of

time. and so what i have sd to the members of congress is that you need over the next 24 to 36 hours to give me some sense of what your plan is to get the debt ceiling raised through whatever mechanisms they can thk about anshow me a plan in terms of what you are doing for deficit and debt reduction. if they show me a serious plan, i'm ready to move. even if it requires some tough decisions on my part. and i'm hopeful that over the nextouple of days we'll se this long jam broken because the american people i think understandably want to see washington do its job. >> charlie: president obama ruled out a 2.4 trillion plan proposed by house republicans. >> my expectation is thayou will probay see the house vote on a couple of things just to make political statements.

but if you are tries to get 2.4 trillion without any revenue, then you are effectively gutting a whole bunch of discretion... domestic spending that is going to be too burdensome and not something that i would support. >> charlie: joining me from washington is chuck todd chief white house correspondent for nbc news and host of the daily rundown on msnbc and hans nichols white house correspondent for bloomberg television. i'm pleased to have both of them here. chuck todd, tell me what consequence came out of the president's press conference that might have changed anything about where we are and where we go between now and august 2nd. >> well, i think if-- i don't know if anything changed, charlie but i think in the president's press conference we heard sort of a resignatn of sorts that he knows how this is going to end. he's going to get a small deal of some sort. and he wants to just define the terms of the post debate after the debt ceiling is raised and

after he signs some sort of bill that might cut a little bit of spending but isn't going to incle any tax hikes on-- of any sort. might include a commission to look at entitlements or a congressional commission tlook at tax reform but ultimately it felt like almost a post debate or a after action report even though we don't technically have the deal yet but we know what the deal is going to lack like. it's going to be a little convoluted, a little very senateese but it will raise the debt ceiling, we are not going to default and a little bit of spending will get cut. >> rose: and what will they say about who won and who lost, other than the american people. >> yeah, i think at the end of the day nobody won this debate. that it was essentially punted to find out whose's winning the battle of public opinion in november of 2012. that said, the actions by senate republicans tell you they

believe they were starting to lose the debate as far as public opinion was concerd. or else yowouldn't have seen mitch mcconnell do these what i would call legislative gymnastics to come up with this solution in order to try to find anyway out of this box, save john boehner a little bit from having to figure out how to convince aunch of house republicans to do this and he did. so iuess you could say the knew the president w winning. ey just didn't want toose badly to him on this round of debate. >> rose: did they take a closer look at what happened to newt gingrich and bill clinton's re- election or did they just know that going in their bones so -- >> no, i think they were surprised on a couple of things. they were surprised that the president called their bluff on the deficit reduction. about two weeks ago when he doubled down and said you know what, let's do the big deal. let's do the $4 trillion plan. he sort of-- sort of came late

to the game. he kind of endorsed the bowles simpson plan which he stl has never fully endorsed but the goals of it, he did endorse in the last couple of weeks so they didn't quite expect that, the republicans in that sense and then that's when they started to retreat from retreat on could up history of '95, think mitc certainly looks at that is bill clinton want to be a looks at 95 i more with was good republicans then. been good, possibly could for house the day he votes to get >> rose: boehner at that to newt >> tt's right. he was in leadership at the think he sees know, the figured it out won. republicans won. is the guy is ying to here and

i different set. he was of a different mindset. >> hans, do you agree with this is the political take plac 2012, that presidentas sense of the resignation. >> well, it's not all resignation implies sort of and don't way to alter forward. i think what you have seen in the last weeks, there is the essentially for comes, happens. you get biden deal deal or would be the $4 trillion those out trillion pretty now, the way them. saying they the what happens recriminations happen press

writing our that guarantee you we end up doing. >> but it will be, the president at the senate, what he wanted to be that will be that will >> the adult at the centre. >> clearly what the white trying to do, january, since you have position being being he's not, the adverse tof his own en very that there are they should might not want the part of their progressive goals. don't get spending under do some of things that the want to dor exciting economy, or future or they have. want to ability to do that they

bond market them no, no, no. >> rose: can the president chuck, because out he was what he does with entitlement cuts? >> you know, i think he can little bit go back to simpson was and today when i-- i asked on bowles wanted credit for creating the commission. making that, fine, but endorse their outcome. of last grabbed that, owning it the end of a lot of white house, believe would have big deal ultimately the one republican that house was on to reeked of a the out higher i would ground solid had he simpson for six what, tom endorsed it he bipartisan hand on stationery, lived on the web site.

kept a approach about it very, very bipartisan consensus in his hand on stationery, lived on the web site. kept a hands off approach about it till the end. >> rose: and why? >> there are some inside the will think might difference place in boy, these white house mistake, there were a d it part of when i started has to do titlement.

endorsthe specifics about medicare and other programs. he did say he wafor a big deal president ta about willing to do on social that just know, he was i will show boner, you the deal with will show publicly on the boehner >> hans? >> ihink there is a the counter to the bowles is had the president got behind that six months the would have never out on that have had in a all of them that you will hear november

for ads republicans eviscerate medicare. the question i think is an open one does their argument... is the argument on that with it ryan out, forward for it or something they afterwards like sure a good didn't come bowles look at the alternative we are at. record far the president said was drew out press where he is on medicare cut a that. >> rose: let me understand, think this up. >> i think it ends up mccoell plus biden like, you he some changes expenditures the loopholes, the very minor cuts in spending.

mostly in defense. and not a touching of security, on the then you have some sort of commission series of next two years further. nothing in the $4 trillion range. boehner could control his party but i think that it is an eternal thing. >> rose: what is going to happen this weekend. >> mitch two senate negotiating the this publicly their plan week, and vote has to do budget

political behind the you we number two senate, number two house, the scenes out how spending cut the agree with mcconnell plus and harry reid and his commisions. by t way, daly, these involved in mcconnell this point. >> rose: right. >> so this is, it's being put together. >> rose: thank you, chuck. >> great to see you, sir. >> rose: hans, welcome and again soon. >> thanks for havinge. >> rose: we move now to the global economy and the context of the conference, that the issued stress conducted on banks region.

eight of 91 institutions insufficiently arrive at a time unease as europe faces the growing risk in the also under ceiling without a standard & poor's is a 50% downgrade the us cdit rating within three months iwashington a bt here in new chambs, soreign committee. economics economist at the from newport california, billounder and investment officer have all of with johns about what d and should surprise? >> i don't think it should that we placed and the a 1 u.s. with credit negative outlook economic debt motivation is the

fiscal prospects government get to a would no compatible with a rating. april we thought the.s. government would have a couple years. we think now the not done probably won't for another couple years, if not done now. the august second is the factorment we ceiling will certainly negotiations have gone expected been more expected. very low high impact would get to without the debt been raised. >> ros it is your lack of

confidence the government has th ability solving problem more than anyhing >> i think that this correct at the matter is the contract and the of between the the democrats. >> rose: bill cross you you have talked about confidence in economy. view of that they very able to co they do, it solion satisfy your own concerns. >> i do, charlie. i think they'll come to some agreement. think what than of the political system for future parliamentary canada or the a rather up or a divided congress and election

mode have just do the right important as indicated but we -- we have can nation younger say we've till you and that's economic for future >> is this more the or congress fault? >> well, i think it's both. intract terms of a canes of moment in democrats are capital injection - stimulus republicans arcapital return to moment that resolution in together on and that i problem. 2012 will it one way >> that will be the great 2012 campaign. >> oh, i think so.

center around jobs center around effect to growth or government those jobs balanced budget in effect to growth or government proper that. >> rose: how dyou see? the inability to deal obvious been a for a while? >> it's profoundly else you and in the weeks it's reality has of pant of weeks i london and come and just seeing the name it build to end the debt raised but fake kind of total bill said really big is the u.s. term going to fiscal hand.

how is the us going to sort out its fiscal situation? fundamental clash, i look outside and that the answer is staring face. relatively low compared to incredibly system and term i see no out the u.s. without increases. got therin debate t. clash. >> rose: you are normally new york, are you in just the home >> thank you. i'm doing the opposite of what faie is doing. london f fascinating u.s. from the london.

a year ago when the government was power in the come out with an austerity plan. people hate the plan. why do we have a better system in the uk? because there's the british they've been before in come through really big is that greece and on its that caused psychological shock politicians but >> rose: bill, what dow make eight out >> and there are small banks spain. what it is the within your.

euro-land has less debt than the united the balance versus the comparing it to a row boat with too many people on one side. rebalancing,ffort from a the ecb or fiscal policy kwn as the get funds to the polal problems have been the day. >> the problems in euroland have the u.s. in but we have a really here for some on the debt s. coupled worsening of crisis in the weeks which shock financial when you have both at same te.

the difference is, that it is a self-inducedess. >> the president tried to in his press >> absolutely. however say fundamental crisis that debt level countries are insolvent and the single basically the clue as to out of it. >> they have. np clarity on how they wil solve thk it is integrity of will start question. >> gillian? >> i was going to say a ago i wrote a colum that made me very unpopular among my colleagues plan to have a this year zanny

says makings of a the next not just t towards a nasty shock zone. important stress test is the governments banks for their government bonds, stressed them the bank trading book, buy and sell. plan to hold to maturity has not actually haircuts. factored in the could lose the type of potential losses have been only in the greece or less, around are lots there in the saying well, much, much scenario has factored into and even so. out of the them. >> and so therefore the could happen.

>> it is a vicious cycle the banks are entwined and if that the gog to get order than would start banks account people were abo their would bolster governments nobody trusts or the unfortunately getting in the from the u.s. zone as politics, politics now. >> it is. basically two euro zone the defaults and has to the system more diametric opposition.

>> i think zanny is right, to an end at we corner posive suppose, theove cross most or all incorporate fiscal union on countries zone and same time and particular have different terms of and the middle of kicking been done for months is type of you have a fiscal problem other

fiscal problem external thought had solve once and euro area. got the market bias banks, major your are the longer additional you are rung deficit of the countries all of cut off. major contributing of this is back into boundaries but a union but a broadal fisc union that

centralized the debt. the united thugh in 1791 jefferson consolidated debt. >> gillian you wergoing to >> gillian you were going to say ill come right back. >> i was going to say on about very amused day some zone the history hamiltonian period in french more irrelevant at the moment. really had at pivot makes it so that on both atlantic you incredibly binary outcomes. see unfold months is inclusion of crunch it vy people to if you are markets but also rating actually assign to the range to what is like greece you can dollar the will you see a downgrades banks because and the are so country if there is

suddenly halty. very developing. >> is thisimply of control leadership of have made a >> think clearly different made a back to wit2008 these are likely moment. the about where d how much are rather big thing now is political much greater were in the end the the and saved forth. source of government inability they he fundamental much scarier no other here. >> rose: four of us here, or of

us arerom the perspective of journalism, at that time agency, very perspective. money on give me a as an this today. you have a lot of money on the line. >> well, we look at it, standpoint of cleanest/dirtiest shirt, all couries have and shirts. as an towards have the sheets, the deficits and importantly, case in devalue or to forward to debt crisis. the united states is in th

category but believe it or not some deloping countries like brazil have cleaner shirts in balance ability to grow. >> we have all seen this the east of economic are going and the simply going that ship? >> i think it is. it's also the what is safe that bill be that economies alys asset, the aaa were safer. this is fast changing. the budget debt loads, emerging than rich world are beginning profound what is a risky asset.

>> i myself am not cerin. can >> can i decoup wheel ever >> we ve export lead investment is export >> if the markets go down, down. >> if you had a serious the developed go down >> gillian. >> you know,. >> go ahead,. >> i tnk that's right, think you technical of flows fundamentals. markets, marts, azil, india growth terms of a underdeveloped and the from that thmarkets. have trillion of dollars worth reserves whereas the countries are in nations so standpoints the countries are in going next five opposed to the developed. >> gillian? >> one of the most intresting things that week when that it

the u.s. debt from a.a.a. that it ratings of american unchanged. the something you seeing in market the markets risk attacks is than some of american similar patent well. unusual. what moodies what you are rkets is a investors are acally, the mpletely fantastic west. run companies th the aren't run the about corporate government. everything els it's about political risk about everything ee. that the used to to emerging people this country but we don't political risks unedictably >> bill what is going to who

hold us treasures. >> how are they going to get there money. >> well, they've got to get problem, in treasuries is that downgraded by rating standard & that the goes up. it's hard to know how much, i would suggest an actual downgrade debt would 25 basis quarter of a terms of over a time. corportationgs and citizens because benchmark for all other debts.

see that and perhaps a cost hundreds of do perhaps a 3 of the u.s. debt is serious >> does monetary policy have today? >> unless the fed does >> absolutely. has an you know this place against slowing prospect great. fed has the in and scenario. of the europe, e plays because it come in this kind union it can it could if god moth europe. is whether prepared to do politically would that the president is first large scale purchase of italian bonds. they could do so too but i think to a lesser degree and against

the backdrop of this loss of confidence in the politician. >> the e.c.b. also has the ability to cause things to break apart because if the ecb stops handling gek bonds and stops accepting them as collateral in its operations as it is threatening it might do then that wou have pretty devastating consequences. and again that could be the beginning of the end game. >> go ahead. >> it could, but it would need to be think in the end have to deci wheer it wants to be a tough central bank with nothing to be a central bank of because it precipitates the breakup what is it going to d >>re we missing anything here in this conversation that could have a dramatic effect on the considerationse are raisg? >> you know, upside, downside. >> well, there's always -- >> there are always geo political issues that could up set the apple cart. >> assassinations, war, oil prices. >> oil prices are sometimes underestimated their impact. bill would have a better view on that than i. but no, i think setting out this perfect storm and august is a slow trading month, many bad things can happen in theonth of august.

>> yeah, let me mention -- >> in financial history. >> that this is from 30,000 as opposed to 25,000 feet, i guess. but the problem in a developed world basically is that they've assumed too much debt and as studies by rogueoff and lion heart they did a book called "it's different this time." as they pointed out through the past century when debt reaches a 90% level, economic growth slows down by about 1%. we have seen that over the past several years, developed nation growth has slowed from three to two and is that a proble well, yes, it is, because 2% is really the level at which we encounter what is called stall speed. it's basically a level which corporate profits don't grow, at whiccorporations stop investin and unemployment is not reduced and perhaps increases. and so this 2% number where we're at really reflects the tipping point, not just for economies but for financial markets going forward.

suppose you had thcapacity to command the politicians to do what you believe was the right thing to do. what kind of agreement would you have coming out of washington. >> i would quickly pass the ceiling with no limitations and then i would move towards a-- an investment bank, a central government directed investment bank where people are put back to work. i mean we have discouraged this idea. i don't know why the o bomba administration has done so by moving to the center but basically it's what's required during periods of time in which unemployme is high and the private sector refuses to invest going forward. and the pital markets. and capital spending. and so what is required, really, obama has recommended an infrastructure bank buwe nd to put people back to work with some type of directed investment in substantial numbers.

it's a complete waste of people power, and productivity to have a 9% plus unemployment ratto have people sittg do as opposed to standing up and working. i would put shovs in their hands. i would get some things done that are required to be done in the united stas. >> rose: gillian? the power goes beyond your. >> well, if are you talking about america, i would ecoso of what bill said but i wod also adopt the simpson bowles bipartisan fiscal commission recommendations for late last year. frankly they were pretty sensible. and they are roughly similar to what the u.k. has been doing. it's very obvious you need a mixture of revenue increases and

spending cuts, 3 to 1 is pretty good proportion and they just pass that now. >> i would do exactly what gillian said. i think the first order would be to pass the debt ceiling, to pass a series-- i think is absurd you have this debt ceiling legislation anyway. most countries pass budgets, pass tax. >> the predent even made that point. >> so i would really increase that so it was no longer an issue. d then you know, the ripe is pretty clear. don't do anything that involves too much short terspending cuts because the economy is incredibly fragile. it needs that support. but t in place a credible mediumerm plan and bowles sison is a pretty good prototype. put thatn place. >> i agree with everything that has been said with one exception, bill's idea of a national developnt bank. weee that, we see kfw and germany. we see the gynea development-- chyna development bank, an instrument of quasi fiscal inactivity. i don't think is very effective policy mechanism. i grant you, i worked project administration could have, was useful in the 30s, maybe useful again but development bank is

something that i wouldn't endorse. but you don't make-- somebody doesn't page-- s&p doesn't make policy recommendations but you need a fiscal plan, it is about 7.5% of gdp and if you don't get that, there is just going to be lessoom to maneuver next te we have a crisis. >> thank you all, a pleasure to you have on the broadcast. back in a moment. stay with us. new developments emerged today in the controversial phone hacking scandal which has rupert murdoch's media empire called news corp. under siege. rebecca brooms of news corporate international resigned after pressure that has already seen the closure of the newof the world and withdrawal of news corp. pl bid to take full control of british sky broadcasting. brooks said in a statement released through news international quotas chief executive of the company fee a deep sse of responsibity for the people we hurt and want to reiterate how sorry mi for what we now know to have sustain place. despite her resignation brooks will still face the house of commons committee next week with rurt mdoch and his sonames murdoch.

this weekend murdoch and news international will apologize to the british public for the phone hacking scandal through a series of full page advertisements headed we are sorry. pert murdoch said news international will take further concrete stepso resolve these issues and make amends for the damage they have caused. joining now to discuss this ongoing story isndrew edgecliff johnson of the financial times. i am pleased to have him here to provide some context to this extraordinary day on one more day in the story. welcome. >> thank you, charlie. >> so where is the story, is it simply waiting for the appearance of the ree of them, murdoch, murdoch and brooks on tuesday? >> i can tell you today is not the end of the story, the resignation of rebecca brooks, and tuesday probably won't be either this is a story which will run for mons if not years with police investigations, judicial inquiries, lawsuits and any number of other threats still piling up against the compan but it's a significant day. i think over the last two weeks we've seen a series of attempts by rupert murdoch and his closest counselors to take the

pressure off, since the allegations first exploded that the news of the world had authorized the accessing of the- - missing teenager who turned out to be rdered mile dowler. in is exploded in the public mind in britain and has spread around the world affecting even u.s. investors perceptions of the wider pire which goes so much widethan these british newspapers. through that period, rupert murdoch and his son james seemed absolutely determined to stand by rebecca brooks, there are very few people in this company who are cler to rupert and the whole family to his children as well than rebecca brooks, she was a very integral memberf this sort of london court that had formed around james and his sister elizabeth and which had included david cameron and other members of the british political media establishment. only a week or so ago rupert murdoch said he had total

confidence in rebecca brooks. the first thing he did when he flew into london to try and sort this crisis out was stage a photo opportunity with his arm around rebecca, asked what his first priority was on landing in london. he pointed to her and said this one. >> rose: so why did she resign? >> i think because the attempts to take the pressure off so far had failed. the closure of the news of the world is dramatic and expense move. this pap had been going for 160 plus years. ruperturdoch bought it 42 years ago it was his big entry on to the world stage after leaving australia. >> rose: the largest circulati paper in london. >> 2 million a day, used to sell 6 to 8 million in its glory days. so this is an extraordinary, papers don't shut down overnight like that either. in these troubled mes. he had done that he pulled the bid for sky. he had agreed after changing his mind on thursday to appear before parliament. none of those things had taken the pressure off.

the reason that he had kept rebecca brooks right by his side for so long was i think in part that she acted as a huge shield. she was a focus of so much of the danger of the british public and media as the former editor of not only the news of the world but the sun and other tabloids owned by news corporate's u.k. newspaper armies international. and if she were to go, then questions would be raised about other people higher up the chain. so her pred ses never this job les hinton was there for 12 years before moving to dow jones. and rupert murdoch's son james took over has head of news corporate european late 2007. one of the first things he had to do was to go in to their newspaper headquarters in east london and try and calm this scandal down. even in 2007 there had been arrests, the royal reporter of the news of the world had been sent to jail by that stage.

so he went and tried to settle with some of the people. that is now coming back. >> so this is a huge test for him. >> it is probably the biggest test in rupert murdoch's career and that sounds a very big claim, about a man whoearly lost his company 20 years ago. i think at the time it was, that was purely business. heas notiating with the banks. and there were scores of banks at the time. and if any one of them had pulled the plug he could have gone under. >> and one had threatened or suggested he might. >> but this is a man who has prospered in the way he has in part by reading e public mood and by infiltrating himself into the political establishment. especially in london where there is this very tight nit group of politicians and media executives who socialize together david cameron and rebekah brooks would ve lunch together in the cotry and in london. so this is an unusual situation in the u.k.

and rupert murdoch for all the fear he was held by many politicianhad en very charmingo the political establishment over the years he sort of almost worked his way to their affections. >> rose: bh labor and tory. >> absolutely. over a very long period, ce back to certainly margaret thcher. >> rose: so what is it that people believe might be there? what is it that e outside might say that murdoch empire has most to worry about? >> so i think there is a general worry, tre is a specific worry. i would say the general worry. >>lready serious stuff on the stable so-- not to minimize that. >> so let's go throu the specific. we have criminal investigations by the metropolitan police. we have potential jucial inquiries. we have a number of lawsuits that had started before, the last two weeks to wo through the cause and it's every likelihood that others will join the lawsuits and we'll get more claims against news corp. which

could be very expensive. i think the more general question is whether news corp. itself, murdoch himself who is known as a hands on proprietor was in some way responsible for setting this culture. whether the aggression, the competitiveness for which he is admired and known. >> is it obvious that the culture at news corp. was different from every other media corporate. >> this is a very important point. certainly in the u.k. there is evidence that the private investigators were doing a lot of this great work were working for a number of other publications up and down fleet street. and so very w brish wspapers emerged with totally clean hands from this. >> have there been investigated as thoroughly as news corporate. >> no, at the moment the investigation has been very much centered on news corporate. the first allegations came out in 2005 that they may have tapped into the voice-mailof

the royal princes william and harry. and so that was where the investigation started. but i think we can very much expect that others will be drawn into it. there have been allegations, some disputed is week that other news intnational papers, the son of the sunday times may ha improperly got hold of information about affecting gordon brown. but -- >> gordon brown suggested that himself. >> he has suggest that himself and the son ran a very strong denial of some of those claims on the front page the other day. so it is still in the realm of a very open and fast moving investigation. not all of these claims will prove to be true. and i think we have to be quite careful to assume that people are guilty before they-- or innocent before proved guilty. >> what do i expect murdoch to do. is there any sense of what he wants to do in his testimony? >> i think he will be quite contrite in his testimony. >> clear from the weekend letter that this is a mind-set that they have. >> i think they have been advertised that the only way out of this now is contrition and apologies.

very much reminded me actually of the play book we saw with bp after the deepwater horizon crisis of a year or so ago. the company was criticized for reacting too late. now no sea bir have died and no fisherman have lost their livelihoods in this particular crisis. butir i think what we're seeing now is a fairly familiar play book, pr play book of you take the product off the shelves whether it's tylenol that has been tarnished or the news of the world and then you start apolizing and then you you say we're going to investigate. >> then you say we'lcooperate with all investigations. >> there is going to be an independent investigation with, you ow, run by people who are not at the company at the time. >> rose: but you suggested this investigation will now not be over next week or the next week or the next week. >> the police have a lot more work to do. they revealed in the last couple of weeks that of the 4,000 names of potential phone hacking

victims found in one investigator's notebook, they so far only contacted 117. so potentially there are another 3800 people to discover that they may have had their phones hacked. >> two quick questions, one, will it extend to the united states. do you think this fbi investigation will turn up something. >> so this week with the fbi is investigating quite specific claim that journalists, representatives of the news of the world may have sought access to the voi-mails of 9/11 victims. now that claim is so far has not beentood up it came from one british nepaper, the mirror it was on an unnamed source, a single source so we are handli it with some care. but there is some political momentum on both sides of the house. mostly democratic representatives. but there e demands for inquiries by the fcc, the doj there are questions regaless of 9/11 allegations if whether it is widely alleged in london

newsf the worland other journalists were bribing british police officers they may fall under the foreign corrupt practices. >> bribing them to get information about stories they were writing. >> exactly. >> there was certainly cole use. >> so what is the one question you most want answered? >> i think the question we want answered is where what is responsibility like. >> who knew what when. >> it is the oldest question. >> what did the president know and when did he know. >> it is one we haven't had answered yet. >> rose: what did rupert murdoch know, james murdoch know wrarx did -- >> from what we hear from people close to the board, back in 200 a v and 70 the board had no sense this was going to explode in the way it has. in 2007 they just bought the "the wall street journal", everybody was focused onhat new adventure for rupert murdoch that new obsession at the time. they were not thinking about what was going on in london. james murdoch went into the u.k. company trying to close this down and hasn't managed to do this. >> thank you for coming.

>> thank you. >> pleasurto have you here.

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